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Brainstorm Creature Mechanic - Controlling creature production
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Rasmus Offline
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Post: #1
Creature Mechanic - Controlling creature production
The next step for me is to enable the player to decide what creatures can be created. I heard a suggestion either here or at the steam forum that one way of doing this could be that if the player don't build any beds for a certain creature then this creature won't be created.

I was thinking of taking it one step further, maybe we could make it so that the player needs to build one bed per creature he wants to be created. So it the player don't want any Impanzees in his dungeon he don't build any Impanzee beds, if he only want 5 impanzees he build 5 impanzee beds. If he have the opportunity to get another impanzee but don't have a bed for him, then I could make it so that a bed icon will flash over the impazee creature in the bottom left menu.

What do you think?
(This post was last modified: 30-09-2014 09:43 AM by Sebt.)
29-09-2014 09:53 AM
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Tamorr Offline
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Post: #2
RE:
I personally don't mind it working that way. Sounds simple enough to work, makes getting certain flow of creatures a bit easier. Still would be nice if that was one thing, but base on some other factors as well. So if it is in addition to the other requirements that would be nice. eg: Orc having a bed, and if there is a bar room build.

I can see imps at the moment just having the bed for the requirement, although that would mean managing your own production in a way. Indirectly that is. After all right now it is the imps that do almost everything.

would this mean also that ones that don't have a bed, get one as well? Also would this mean each bed would have an owner?
29-09-2014 03:43 PM
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Rasmus Offline
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Post: #3
RE:
Atm each bed wouldn't get a specific owner, it is just as a counter for maximum allowed creatures for the player.

So I have reconsider, instead of forcing the player to have one bed per creature, I will just make it so that the bed will enable a certain creature type. The amount of creatures will be handled in future versions.

I have made a fishman bed, I will not make a bed for the knight and the rogue just yet... Still not sure if I want these creatures to be produced by the Dark Mother.
But the fishman will need food / rest and be equipable in the next version.
29-09-2014 05:32 PM
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Ardilor Offline
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Post: #4
RE:
It's really hard to get leather at the beginning of game, especially on hard + difficulty. Defending against first wave without orcs generated by bar room will be impossible.
29-09-2014 06:56 PM
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Sebt Offline
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Post: #5
RE:
I saw on steam forum that idea about bed and liked very much (can't find where was it suggested unfortunately...).
I remember in DK 1 all types of available creatures was coming to your dungeon, even those who I won't need like Flies, Sorceror or Trolls, but I needed rooms that attract them, so... this bed idea is quite a great solution.

I also wonder how would it work for workers? Maybe we could only need beds to build creatures, but Imps would still be produced according to workload? Of course I assume Imps will be workers, not other creatures, but if Rasmus would like to have diversified workers (Piggeh work in Cookery Room, Orcs works in Metalwork Room, Fishman do fishing - replace Imps in doing these jobs) we would need to think how to adjust creatures to room available jobs, to not have so much creatures, but be able with some to handle whole production.

I like the idea of owning beds - it sounds logical once you make bed and so the creature it will be assigned to that bed.

We would think about limiting amount of creatures player could make, because one could make 10 beds and get 10 creatures in 5 seconds. Maybe that amount of creatures you would be able to make could depend on what certain Room building will be build - like Tamorr suggested, but to limit creature number costs of that Room building could be growing for each new creature made (exponentially, logarithmically, don't know)?
So for example to make 1st Piggeh you need to built in Cookery room certain Room building (or 2, whatever) for 4 units of certain resources, however to make a next Piggeh you'll need to make the same widget, but this time it's cost would be higher for example 10 units of certain resources and so on, so on.
I don't know how to explain why that costs is growing. We could also somehow depend cost on overall creatures number you already have so player would be able to make 10 Orcs and 10 Piggehs for similar cost to like you would make 18 Piggehs.
I support The Venus Project & Resource-Based Economy - The feasible plan to get rid of scarcity, poverty, and other incoming global issues.
(This post was last modified: 30-09-2014 09:25 AM by Sebt.)
30-09-2014 09:13 AM
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Tamorr Offline
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Post: #6
RE:
Exponential costs eh... hmm.. that wouldn't be so bad. Would make sense in the logical sense in the very least to keep the numbers down. Well the max anyhow. Not sure what the actual reasoning would be though from the dungeon sense, that would be a toughy for myself to think of a possibility. Sure eventually there will sprout an idea.

Piggeh I would love to see eventually. Having specific jobs for each creature is something that may help in the long run, so you know when to add or need to add more of a certain type. At least for a specific style of play or two. Those that only want a certain type of creature would still need a universal worker though.

In that case I would think imps would be fine for that. Could be imps can work in all, but once the one for the job is created those will take over from there.

I actually like the imp producing via need/workload. Then possible to reduce there after when not needed as I read somewhere else.

It is a good step forward I think, even if not at the moment for personal beds, at least it is a thought. And nice to hear I might be able to make beds for those aquatic mates... Smile That is something I like to do is making room designation to separate the creatures sleeping space.
30-09-2014 03:21 PM
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David Bacuvka Offline
Dungeon Lord

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Post: #7
RE:
i think current way is great, but I would like removal of incremental production time, if i can make them happy why would you punish me by slowing production? time should scale only with happiness nothing else, production will slow down when their happiness decrease and stop when they became unhappy simple and efficient, i want 999 orcs if i can support them why wont you let me? current state when production almost stops after 5 is boring and very limiting, creatures should be pumping one after other, ofc this 100% happiness (100% workload for workers) timer would differ based on creature, making imps fastest like two per minute (one per minute with 50% workload) and some late game badass could even take 15minutes to create

and to take bed idea, single bed would work as production started, meaning when you build 1st bed creatures who use it would start coming (including imps), when you lose/sell this bed nothing should happen, lack of rest should bring happiness down by itself stopping the production even rioting them

as for population control i suggest fed to dark mother comeback this time eating unwanted creatures, she surely likes some fishmen for breakfest
01-10-2014 07:06 PM
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Rasmus Offline
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Post: #8
RE:
I would like to continue the discussion here about how the player can limit the creature production. I like the idea of having the the DM eat the unwanted creatures, but how should the player control this option visually, I would like a GUI for it, but preferably something small that don't take that much room.

One idea I am having is to add an extra button in the creature options (at the icons at the bottom left), so when the player hovers a creature type he or she will get the option too also set a limit for the number of the creatures this type may have.
21-10-2014 07:03 AM
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Sebt Offline
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Post: #9
RE:
Umm... this: Pit of The Damned ? Big Grin

Sebt Wrote:Info
Has got some useless, resource wasting minions, would like to off load someone just for great fun? What's more retrieve some resources from victim?! Well, just throw it into the Pit of The Damned and enjoy the show!

Appearance
It's literally an ardent hole in the ground. Nothing super spectacular until...

[Image: burning_man.jpg]
Pic.1. ...it starts to burn useless minion into beautiful... gray... ashes. <3

Stats
Highlight: Burns useless minions and extracts some resources from them.
Function: When you built a Pit of The Damned, in Creatures Menu a Pit of Damned button will appear. When clicked it starts to burn! Yesssss, burnnnn, flames everywhere... Then after clicking that amazing button you can select creatures you would like to burn in the Pit of The Damned. After selecting them and clicking "Sacrifice Selected Creatures" and then after confirming by clicking "Yes" in poped-up menu that "Are you sure you about sacrificing selected creatures?" the whole process will start - selected creatures will go with sad faces to the Pit of The Damned.
Note: creature will burn with it's equipment, but don't worry, some of resources from it's equipment will be retrieved too.
Room Type: Building.
Affiliate to: What about Dark Mother? If not, than any other Room when you can do strange rituals, deal some sweet pain, do terrible things with something or someone. Maybe Torture Room - any ideas?
Place: Ground.
Cost: 60% Magma Pots and 40% Stones.
I support The Venus Project & Resource-Based Economy - The feasible plan to get rid of scarcity, poverty, and other incoming global issues.
21-10-2014 08:53 AM
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Mello Tonin Offline
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Post: #10
RE:
I remember that one. Burning Man meets Dwelvers, you can't go wrong with that. To make things simpler for now, maybe you just add a Feed to Dark Mother button in the Creature/Equipment window. I would bet the main complaint about too many creatures has more to do with Imps than the other minions.
21-10-2014 02:57 PM
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Sebt Offline
The Evil Admin
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Post: #11
RE: Creature Mechanic - Controlling creature production
(21-10-2014 02:57 PM)Mello Tonin Wrote:  I remember that one. Burning Man meets Dwelvers, you can't go wrong with that. To make things simpler for now, maybe you just add a Feed to Dark Mother button in the Creature/Equipment window. I would bet the main complaint about too many creatures has more to do with Imps than the other minions.

Yea. We use "feed to DM mechanism" on prisoners, so that mechanism could work well too.
I support The Venus Project & Resource-Based Economy - The feasible plan to get rid of scarcity, poverty, and other incoming global issues.
21-10-2014 05:24 PM
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