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My New Idea Game Mode - Non-Controlled Overworld
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AeriousAlexander Offline
Dungeon Lord

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Post: #1
Game Mode - Non-Controlled Overworld
In the last version of Dwelvers I had played (I've been out of the loop in last two months or so), we now had access to the overworld, generated threat, and had waves of enemies attacking the dungeon.

My frustration was two fold, the higher challenge difficulties would make it impossible to create a sizable force before being crushed by high level knights. On the other hand lower difficulties posed little challenge.

I though I'd direct everyone's attention to a Dungeon Building game of the non-fantasy type, which I am certain atleast a fair amount of you had hear about. "Evil Genius"

In Evil genius, we had no direct contact with the outside of the evil base. You could send "away" teams which either generated revenue, or completed missions. This prevented the player from every defeating the opposition in any conventional manner, but it also allowed for a constant need to interact with, (goals, finance, objects, etc).

[Image: worldmap.jpg]

My idea would be to once again make the overworld not directly intractable, but as in Evil Genius to send raiding parties. Which depending on their size, composition, and duration would amass increasing amounts of threat, which would result in a proportional response from the world above.

Raiding the overworld can now have many benefits such as:

- Plentiful amounts of material (at least plentiful in comparison to dungeons).

- Unique resources (Such as Plants that grow only on surface, or high grade of metal smithy that the creatures dont know how to replicate)

-Captives

-Unique items that will provide passive bonuses/resources
-One idea was that creatures would bring a "holy item" which causes negative passive effects to creatures. they must then guard against constant assault waves until it is "corrupted" and provides positive passive effects. An item that stray raiders can re-possess from the dungeon if left unguarded.
(This post was last modified: 04-12-2015 01:28 PM by Sebt.)
04-12-2015 12:19 AM
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David Bacuvka Offline
Dungeon Lord

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Post: #2
RE:
Huge fan of EG here Smile

I would prefer this kind of surface interaction, similar to trading, but seems lot to abandon (work on surface world)

to be completely honest, I stopped playing Dwelvers around time we got surface world, so my opinion on surface is bit outdated, but i feel its not necessary in the game about evil realm domination, unless the game has changed its focus to surface domination and battle between lords to see who has more of it.
05-12-2015 07:21 PM
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Sebt Offline
The Evil Admin
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Post: #3
RE:
A sort of idea is also present in Impire - DK-inspired dungeon builder. You could send your creatures outside the map to various mini locations where you could fight for loot and there you could take control over this fight instead of of i.e. getting battle report only.

If it comes to difficulty levels they're still under balance work and I expect that Rasmus will do some optimalization in the near future.

The goal of the surface world was to have another location, part of the map that could have some extra resources you could find plenty there which are quite scarce in underworld. Also it is surface guys, mainly humans domain and there therefore "surface world" is the source of human presence, that if map conditions apply will need to be cleaned up from enemies.

I have mixed fillings about that, surface world in it's current form is a quite big feature that will probably not be turned into anything else - it may also be important to the game lore as in the whole concept of the surface world riding underworld it could be nice to make revenge of their constant attacks, so if it's only matter of difficulty levels of the game we would need to think how to balance already existing feature rather than changing it's form, I guess. The trade mechanics in Dwelvers are already working more-less like you suggested, but without sending troops to different locations.
I support The Venus Project & Resource-Based Economy - The feasible plan to get rid of scarcity, poverty, and other incoming global issues.
(This post was last modified: 05-12-2015 11:24 PM by Sebt.)
05-12-2015 11:15 PM
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AeriousAlexander Offline
Dungeon Lord

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Post: #4
RE: Game Mode - Non-Controlled Overworld
(05-12-2015 11:15 PM)Sebt Wrote:  If it comes to difficulty levels they're still under balance work and I expect that Rasmus will do some optimalization in the near future.

It's not so much the balancing that had me somewhat flustered. In Evil Genius, even if you were sitting quietly in your little Island Fortress, you would still get regularly investigated by small bands of 'Investigators' who could potentially raise alarms about your misdeeds on the island. This would mean you'd get regular interactions/battles while undergoing simple tasks (such as construction or micromanaging) which in Dwelver equivalent would be small raiding parties or 'adventurers and glory seekers.'

However there was a certain delight in sending an "away team" to pull some misdeed while also preparing the base to not only handle the income heavily armed response but also to minimize the damage they do (such as raising alarms to make your minions arm themselves, but also taking them off unimportant trivial tasks). This I find really lacking in Dwelvers, the big score and the big fight(I find taking overworld entrances to be either brutal or trivial depending on my prep).

(05-12-2015 11:15 PM)Sebt Wrote:  The goal of the surface world was to have another location, part of the map that could have some extra resources you could find plenty there which are quite scarce in underworld. Also it is surface guys, mainly humans domain and there therefore "surface world" is the source of human presence, that if map conditions apply will need to be cleaned up from enemies.

That was my hope too, but after trying it out I found several fatal flaws (not in the execution but rather in concept). Having the tunnel network not only creates control of minion/enemy flow, but more importantly a pathing system that becomes the heart of the dungeon. My experience with the open pathing of the overworld (which makes sense why it is like that), requires dozens upon dozens of 'troops' in order to maintain any sense of order (That makes me Lawful Evil?). What usually ends up is single file chases of wounded minions/enemies running endlessly from pursuers, which scatter both forces to the wind; it also makes both forces extremely open to flanking and geurrila tactics (usually imps carrying loot getting mugged).

It also in its form has very little replay value throughout the same gameplay. Raided villages (or groupings of homes rather) once burnt remain burnt forever. Thus making it seem as though the greatest threat is handful of farmers and occasional guards. Yet creating strongholds (castles for instance) takes away from the 'Den of Evil' set of a dungeon. Much the same if Evil Genius had to take on a full military rather than investigators/saboteurs/commandos. However making the overworld an "away team" set up would atleast allow the fantasy that we raid and pillage with the mighty empires sending their best fortune seeking bounty hunters and imperial guards to try and crush the dungeon.
08-12-2015 03:52 AM
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