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Team News 2014.05.09 - The fall of Towns
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Rasmus Offline
Main developer of Dwelvers
Dwelvers Developers

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Post: #16
RE:
Hi Demetrius, welcome to the forum Smile

I saw that you posted this in two other topics, so I hope you don't mind if I just answer here.
Can't say that I haven't followed the development of Towns since I made this topic, I am aware that Ben is helping Xavi out with some of the graphics now when Xavi decided to get working on Towns again. This may or may not hurt Dwelvers, I don't know. If Towns get finished at some point it is only good. But as I have said in multiple topics before, Ben is there for Dwelvers every day and always coming with feedback and are helping me out, he has done a lot more than ever was expected of him, from my experience I have never seen anything else but motivation from him. And I know for a fact that Ben was not the reason that Towns stopped being developed, this is something Xavi has admitted himself both for me and for the whole Towns forum. There is always measures that could have been taken in foresight, and it is easy to guilt someone for the action that a person didn't take even if this person acted in good faith. The bottom line is that Ben did everything in his power to solve the crisis with Towns, this is nothing I can prove to you but it is something that I know. So in opinion Ben has done nothing wrong, but he has gotten a lot of bad critique for his involvement in Towns. If I were to ask Ben to stop working for Dwelvers just because I am afraid that this critique would smear of on Dwelvers and I know that Ben is not the one to blame, then what person would I be? Having Ben helping out with the development of Dwelvers is the best thing that ever could have happen to this game!

I didn't mean to come on to strong here, I realize that I may sound very defensive in my words, but that is just how I feel. I want to keep the discussion going if you have any objections or questions Smile
25-06-2014 02:00 AM
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Demetrius Offline
Dungeon Lord

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Post: #17
RE:
"If I were to ask Ben to stop working for Dwelvers just because I am afraid that this critique would smear of on Dwelvers and I know that Ben is not the one to blame, then what person would I be?"

I think it would make you a smart business person. The hate is very strong. Enough for me to create another account on here after being banned for one post saying I was boycotting the game because of burning pet. Was I banned by him?
25-06-2014 03:11 AM
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Rasmus Offline
Main developer of Dwelvers
Dwelvers Developers

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Post: #18
RE: 2014.05.09 -The fall of Towns
(25-06-2014 03:11 AM)Demetrius Wrote:  "If I were to ask Ben to stop working for Dwelvers just because I am afraid that this critique would smear of on Dwelvers and I know that Ben is not the one to blame, then what person would I be?"
I think it would make you a smart business person.

I am a programmer who love to make games, I am not a business person. When I see undeserved negative critique I don't take actions for personal gain, and in this case I think Dwelvers would suffer more without Ben.

(25-06-2014 03:11 AM)Demetrius Wrote:  The hate is very strong. Enough for me to create another account on here after being banned for one post saying I was boycotting the game because of burning pet. Was I banned by him?

You were, I don't know why he banned you or what you wrote to make him ban you. I usually keep the discussion going to see if it is possible to reach some common ground or if you have any further questions. If you or anyone else don't want to support the game because you know that SMP gets a cut of the sales then that only applies to Steam, not buying the game from the website. This is something that Ben has advertised himself.

You said you have read all the posts here on the forum regarding Dwelvers involvement with SMP, and you still think it is wrong that I support Ben. As you may have figured out from reading all those posts and reading my last post I don't agree with you. If you just want to ventilate your feelings because SMP has done you wrong and indirectly try to destroy Dwelvers reputation, then I agree with banning you. But if you have any constructive feedback we can keep the discussion going.
25-06-2014 03:34 AM
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Demetrius Offline
Dungeon Lord

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Post: #19
RE:
I do not have any constructive feedback. I believe I was banned by burning pet. I find it honorable that you confront the issue head on and don't just ban people like I was just hours before on this very forum. I'm not here to destroy Dwelvers reputation, but I don't want the developers of towns to get a single cent of money from anyone else, unfortunately he is involved in this game. I understand you defending your partner and I'm sure I am not even close to the only one that feels this way. If his job is to get the game on steam that you picked the wrong person as he is very hated on steam and I will post negatively about Dwelvers dev burning pet if it does make it there and warn of his reputation. I dont see this as destroying Dwelvers reputation but simply warning others of what he did in the past. He can call me a troll all he wants on there and ban me from here as it doesn't matter. You state that SMP gets money from Steam sales, but does burningpet get money from all sales? I have nothing else to say about Dwelvers or you personally Rasmus.
(This post was last modified: 25-06-2014 04:01 AM by Demetrius.)
25-06-2014 03:56 AM
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Rasmus Offline
Main developer of Dwelvers
Dwelvers Developers

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Post: #20
RE:
You were banned by Ben as I said, but I suspect the reason is because you two already have had a very long discussion about it on the Steam Towns forum.

BurningPet and Xavi invested the same amount into Dwelvers and they will only get a cut from the steam sales, not from anywhere else. This is nothing that I try to hide, it says on the contact page on the Dwelvers site that we are supported by SMP. This is the situation and I think it would do more damage if it is something that we tried to hide. When I entered partnership with SMP Towns were still being developed, after that it went bad. That is the situation and there is nothing that can be done about it except being honest!

I would prefer not to continue this discussion as it is leading nowhere. I know where you stand, and you know where I stand. Just saying that this discussion is leading nowhere as we both has reached an impact.
25-06-2014 05:02 AM
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Demetrius Offline
Dungeon Lord

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Post: #21
RE:
Thank you for listening.
25-06-2014 05:22 AM
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Shadow of the Impanzee Offline
Lunatic in Madman's clothing

Posts: 23
Joined: Jun 2014
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Post: #22
RE:
It's sad to see any project go... Even though things went wrong, I'm glad to see that at least one of the members is already trying again. Good luck, BurningPet [and Xavi, if you happen to be reading this].
The time of Titans is over... now, the throne of the World is ours for the taking... and I intend to be the next one to look out over the mountains and oceans from that crystalline perch. Stand with me, and a million times a million souls will know you as one of the Great Lords and Ladies of ancient legend... or stand against me, and be left as little more than a smear of ash amidst the dust of history...
26-06-2014 09:49 AM
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polo5021 Offline
Dungeon Lord

Posts: 48
Joined: May 2015
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Post: #23
RE: 2014.05.09 - The fall of Towns
I bought Towns awhile ago and was fairly unaware of the mess that went on until recently, overall the game was brilliant, it had its obvious flaws but you could work around them and the game was fairly well written. I'm not unhappy about the developers leaving the game if they (or another company) intends to boot it back up again.

Playing with almost 125 hours on towns means I got my moneys worth anyway. Big Grin

I believe that for Dwelvers, there is a strong community for a "Dungeon Keeper" based game and that if you tap into that with a fully functional and finished game, you will create a path for more Dungeon based strategic games in the future.
24-05-2015 02:33 PM
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Mello Tonin Offline
Guru O' Mello

Posts: 2.216
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Post: #24
RE:
That's a good way to look at it. I didn't get into the Towns game, but I've seen the backlash from some here and on Steam. It's unfortunate what happened, but that's the way it goes sometimes. I often use that same reasoning to justify any game purchase considering the cost isn't much more than going out to movies once or twice, so if you get 2 - 4 hours of enjoyment out of it, then it's not a total waste. Fortunately what happened with those guys hasn't really had to much of an effect on the interest in this game exempting a couple people wanting to rant about anything and everything Towns or related to Towns. I picked this title up shortly after discovering the WftO game which was my first leap into Early Access games, and it's been really fun getting a chance to help it progress into the game it is now and what will be.
24-05-2015 03:00 PM
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polo5021 Offline
Dungeon Lord

Posts: 48
Joined: May 2015
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Post: #25
RE: 2014.05.09 - The fall of Towns
Not gonna lie, but I pretty much bought this game for three reasons.

1. The game looked really cool
2. The game is very similar to Dungeon Keeper 2, which I couldn't play when I was younger.
3. Upon researching the stuff that happened with Towns, I heard that the developer was investing into this game.

I just hope that there isn't a repeat, you have my full support Rasmus. Smile
(This post was last modified: 24-05-2015 03:26 PM by polo5021.)
24-05-2015 03:25 PM
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Rasmus Offline
Main developer of Dwelvers
Dwelvers Developers

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Post: #26
RE:
Hi polo5021 and welcome to the forums Smile
I just want to say that the developer of Towns (Xavi) that discontinued the development don't have anything to do with the actual development of Dwelvers, neither did I have anything to do with the development of Towns. So the connection that Towns got discontinued would apply to Dwelvers as well is a comparison that shouldn't be made.
24-05-2015 04:27 PM
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polo5021 Offline
Dungeon Lord

Posts: 48
Joined: May 2015
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Post: #27
RE: 2014.05.09 - The fall of Towns
I understand now.

I hope you all the best with this development of Dwelvers, as such, I will assist in anyway I can in terms of bug findings and errors!
I've played through the game so far and found it enjoyable (a bit confusing at first due to the fact that you can skip the tutorial by killing the enemies and winning the game before you complete the tutorial).
But I'm hopeful that this game will turn into a very enjoyable game.
24-05-2015 04:48 PM
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